raising objections..again

One area of Epstein’s book that I feel can further my conversations would be raising objections. I thought this area was something that we face in everyday life. Whether it be customers we are dealing with, or someone that’s catering to us. We face ideas and thoughts that we object to all day long, simply because everyone has their own beliefs. I think raising objections is just a way for you to show how you feel about a situation or idea that someone has shown you. I think there often times wrong ways of raising objections and that it tends to scare people. If done properly you or the other person might be able to learn more about an idea that you may not have known before. It is almost one of those situations where you don’t want to judge a book by its cover, because maybe you havn’t done enough research on that book to know what it is your talking about.

favorites!

One of my favorite things during the class would probably be the group projects. I think personally for me I enjoyed them so much because of the people in my group. We had fun skype conversations and random emails going back and forth, but it allowed us to get to know each other quickly because of the projects that needed to be completed. Although I am sure we all had some snags, overall my group was amazing and there some people that I am sure I will keep in contact with!! One of my least favorites was having to rememeber to go online to do the posts. I think for me with my poor interent service and little time it was hard to do it every 12 hours. However I understand the point of the time constraint and being a little more organized in order to complete them. Other than that I had a blast in the class, the teacher was very thorough and helpful.

what i have learned.

This class has definitely taught me a lot about the way we communicate with people. There were chapters in Epstein's book that I never would have considered to be important until I read them and was able to understand what it was that Epstein was trying to tell us. One idea that I think shocked me and taught me a lot would be Chapter 10 the appealing to fear and just how well it can be used. I always knew about appealing to emotion, but I think the examples that had been used as well as the overall information that Epstein gives, threw me for a loop and made me realize just how powerful appealing to someone's emotions can be. All in all Epstein was able to teach us so much, some of it was very confusing but others made perfect sense and it makes you more aware of what you are saying and how you go about saying it.

cause and effect

Reading through the cause and effect website was actually interesting and I have to say a little confusing at a few different parts.  I had never heard of arguing causation. I found this term to be fairly interesting and realize we use this type of arguing a lot, but I never knew that was the name of the argument.  The example that was used on the website made it a little easier to understand what the author was trying to justify. However the one area that caused a little confusion was when they were talking about post hoc reasoning and reverse causation. The idea of reverse causation made sense because it was simply the other version of arguing causation. However the idea of post hoc reasoning I am still a little unsure of how or what you would use it for.  But overall the website was fairly helpful, partly because I am in a business law class and the example used was relatable.

Judging Analogies

One area that I found to be interesting and helpful in chapter 12 was the judging analogies. Epstein mentions that in order to use an analogy is must be clearly stated, otherwise often times one side of the analogy can be too vague to use. I agree with this and often times find it hard to understand why somebody would use a specific analogy when trying to make their point or in order to prove someone wrong. I liked the first example that Epstein used, talking about Magic Johnson and HIV. At first the statement is hard to understand or follow and I would have to guess at why they decided to compare the military to an NBA star. However once they begin to explain the basis of the argument it makes sense and shows how you can use analogies but often times need to show the premises in order to people to completely understand what it is you are trying to tell them.

appeal to emotion

So I must say this is probably one of my favorite chapters because Epstein is able to state what needs to be said and move on. No more searching through words to find out what it is he is hoping to get across to students who read his books. I do love the appealing to emotion chapter because it lays out all of the different way that people encounter and use others emotions. I have already discussed the appeal to fear as being one of my least favorite because of how people use the fear in someone in order to get their support; I think it is way too twisted. However one appeal that I find interesting would be the feel good argument. I think this is something as college students that we often times feel is necessary or well deserved way of handling situations. However we all know how those conversations would most likely play out, no so well. However the idea that we use the appeal to feel good about ourselves is at least a positive way of making people see another side to an argument.  Trust me if the world worked this way, we would all be dumb and crazy because we weaseled out of situations that eventually benefitted us.

appealing to fear

In Chapter 10, I was shocked at how short it was, however though it was short it had a lot of information that was interesting and hopefully it will be beneficial as well. One idea that I found to be interesting was appealing to fear. I thought it was first interesting that Epstein mentioned that this was a common way for politicians and advertisers to manipulate the public people. From the example they used in the book I think that it is absolutely true. However I think the unstated conclusion is the worst part about it, simply because they feel if they can scare the public, then the public in turn will learn to trust them. I think this is the worst way of appealing to people. By using a person’s fear in order to get them to do something to benefit others is horrible. I am a person that has a lot of fears and therefore if someone tried to use them against me, I think that is a low way of trying to get someone to vote for you or trust you.

valid and invalid forms of general claims

The second part of Epstein’s chapter 8 deals with some of the valid and invalid forms in regards to general claims. I found this part of the chapter to be extremely helpful as I am a very kinesthetic learner. The visuals and diagrams allowed me to follow along with what Epstein was saying and better understand it. One thing I found extremely helpful was the idea of diagrams, since they allow you to get involved with a claim and draw out what the premises are and thus allow you to see if the claim really is valid or whether it is a claim that is not strong enough to be valid. Epstein also talked about reasoning in a chain an direct ways of reasoning as well as arguing backwards. Again all of these had visuals way of understanding the ideas and make the information that Epstein was talking about easier to understand.

chapter 8

In chapter 8 Epstein talks a lot about the general claims that we often make in everyday life. These claims often seem valid and premises may be true yet some of the facts are not always present and available, therefore it can be hard to see if the statement is valid. Epstein also mentions that there are multiple ways in which we can make general claims and thus there are many ways to introduce contradictions to those claims. From the reading of this first part of chapter 8, I think it is something that is often very common in our everyday chats, seeing as how I came up with several conversations in my head in which I would question if the statement was valid or not. I think this is something that is very helpful to learn and understand, so that we may no longer make such general claims. It took me several readings in order to find out exactly what Epstein was trying to say.

assignment importance

I think that both of our group papers have had great importance for the course and for us as students. For the second assignment I think it pushes us as students and people in the society to get to know the good deeds that we can do to help others in need, whether that be countries in disaster or animals in fear of extinction. The second assignment had groups searching for information on a specific social organization that we found to be interesting. Our group chose the American Red Cross, mainly because we found it to be interesting especially with the catastrophe in Japan. I had always known of the American Red Cross, but having to do further research allowed me to really learn and understand the concept that they strive to obtain. I think social organizations like these to a lot of good in the world and help people in desperate need of aid.

Raising Objections

I read chapter 7 of Epstein’s book and one area that I found to be fairly interesting was the "Raising objections." One interesting thing that I liked that Epstein said was that raising objections is a way of showing that an argument is bad. I completely agree, because if someone didn’t raise any objections, then clearly they agree with you, or they are too afraid to state their objections. By raising objections it often shows other people your point of view and can sometimes change one's mind on a topic they created an argument for. One example that I experienced in my every day life dealt with stereotypes and an argument about a specific breed of dogs. A young couple came into my store with a Doberman Pinscher one day to shop around. After the couple left an older lady came up to me, with her poodle in her arms, and stated that she didn’t understand why people would get a Doberman when they are so vicious and mean. I stared at her in disbelief, thinking that her little yapping poodle was more likely to bite me then the sweet Doberman that I had just spent 15 minutes playing with. I raised my objection and said that they are sweet dogs when properly socialized, and as I reached to pet her dog, it started to snarl and yip. I looked at her and smiled and said that there is no mean gene in a dog’s genetics; it is simply the way they are raised and handled within their families. She walked away somewhat gloomy, seeing as I had a valid point. To me there is no reason to not raise objections when you don’t believe in something or don’t feel something is true, raising objections is your way of showing your feelings toward it.

Another idea that I found to be somewhat helpful was refuting an argument directly. This to me goes hand in hand with raising objections in the sense that you are bringing about a different idea or argument and stating that a premises is unconvincing. Overall I thought this chapter was interesting and had some good examples to back up what Epstein was stating.

Reasoning in a chain and slipper slope

In chapter 6, Epstein talks about compound claims, and how they exist in our conversations and arguments. One idea that helped me, or that I found interesting was the reasoning in a chain. This idea helps to validate an argument, however doesn’t always make it good. To reason in a chain Epstein states that you have to state conditionals in order for a chain to work correctly. By showing the steps you are able to prove that your argument is valid.

For example: If you buy a puppy then you will have to spend a lot of money on him. If you spend a lot of money then you can’t go on vacation. If you can’t go on vacation then you won’t get to relax. So if you get a puppy then you can’t relax. By showing the steps it takes from the first statement to the last, it causes a chain of reasoning.

Now for slippery slope, this is a bad argument in which someone states a false condition within the chain. For example: If you buy that shirt then you’ll want to go out. If you go out then you’ll meet a guy. When you meet the guy you’ll fall in love. Then you’ll get married and we can’t go shopping anymore. 

These statements are not completely true simply because she bought a shirt, the chain of conditions don’t seem plausible.

Overall I think Epstein’s breakdown helps me to realize to make a statement or argument valid I have to make sure my conditions are correct. Geesh who knew how complicating our conversations could get!! Lol

Advertising

http://www.covergirl.com/makeup-looks

I was on the Covergirl website browsing through their products. Like their commercials, Covergirl states the beauty one can find within the use of their products.

I feel that their claim for makeup is the perfect blend to get the "bold, look at me" look that many women desire from their makeup. Evaluating the premises-Why should we as consumers believe that Covergirl makeup is going to give us every look that we as a society crave? What proof do they show us to make us believe and trust that their makeup is going to make me look the best? Like Epstein says, we can't always get the justification that we often seek. Though commercials and faces of actresses we love have a definite way of helping us trust what Covergirl claims.

Personal experience- This also has a lot to do with how we feel about certain products, although sometimes we can be apprehensive in trying new things. However going back to what Epstein said " our most reliable source of information about the world is our own experience."

Common Mistakes in Evaluating Premises

One idea that I found to be interesting and somewhat enlightening was the "Common Mistakes in Evaluating Premises" in Chapter 5. Arguing backwards was a little confusing at first, but then the idea that just because an argument is strong and the conclusion is true does not always mean that the premises are true. I think my favorite mistake and probably one of the more common mistakes that we make in evaluating premises would be the "bad appeals to authority." I know for me personally I often find myself doing this, stating an argument is true or valid simply because I trust the source I heard it from or because a person I trust feels the same way I do. Therefore rather than taking the claim as false or looking for the facts and premises, we often just assume it is true because of the source. Another common mistake that I know I make is mistaking the person for the claim. Again this idea that Epstein suggests many of the same ideas as bad appeals to authority. It is incorrect to reject a claim because of the source. Overall these ideas and concepts actually make it easier to understand the ideas of premises and statements. Epstein has a way of surprising me every time I read a new chapter.

So it's bad..so what..

This class has definitely made me more aware of my statements and thoughts, I think that Epstein has a unique way of making people think. However I think Epstein’s point about correcting friends and people around you is valid, and makes for a great issue. I know just recently for me I have been thinking more and analyzing what I say, more often. It has created somewhat of a monster, lol well sort of. I definitely try to think through my thoughts and responses thoroughly before actually saying them. Thus like Epstein mentions, before you go about correcting other people, “be gentle and educate” them, let them understand what is correct and incorrect about what they are stating, don’t just bash them. I definitely think I have to get the hang of it 100% myself before I can go around correcting people surrounding me. I know after this class, I will be making stronger and hopefully correct statements.

fallacies

Fallacies are very interesting statements in my opinion. At first glance I was confused on just what these were, however further reading allowed me to somewhat grasp the idea of what fallacies are. To me fallacies are an overall error in reasoning, or a misjudgment.

I choose mistaking the person for the claim. My understanding of these fallacies leads me to believe that when someone states using this type of fallacy, it gives them no credibility. They have nothing in their statement that would support what they just stated.

My example is thus: Anything Kori says about breeding blue pits is going to be wrong. This statement is a fallacy, because nowhere in that statement does it explains why that might be true or what reasoning I have behind it to back my statement up.

Fallacies is a very confusing and yet simple concept. I think the most difficult part about it is being able to spot one or trying to create one, if you can’t already tell in mine. =]

Tests for a good argument

For a statement to be a good argument it must pass three tests. The premises must be plausible, the premises must be more plausible than the conclusion and the argument must be valid or strong.
An example would be: At work, if by the end of the fiscal month you have sold a minimum of $10,000 in premier dog food, than you will earn an extra $100 on your next paycheck. The end of the month comes and the total sold for premier dog food was $11,257. Therefore I get an extra $100 on my next paycheck.
The premises is valid and is thus more plausible than the conclusion within the first two statements. If a certain goal amount of dog food was sold, there is an opportunity to earn extra money. By my total reaching $11,257 I clearly have passed the minimum goal and therefore deserve the extra $100 bonus. To me this example is a good argument.

Good Statements

I found that Epstein has a very unique way of seeing things, and is thus able to shine lights on topics I would never think of. The idea of making a good statement or a statement that is plausible was fairly interesting to me. Therefore in order for a statement to be a good statement, than we should have good reason to believe the premise of a statement, and then ultimately believe the conclusion of that statement. Premises in my understanding are the guidelines or boundaries in which the conclusion must stay in, in order for the statement to then be a good statement.  Yet just because a statement may have premises, those premises need to be plausible and give the reader reason to believe in the premises. As well as the premises needs to have a connection to the conclusion. Otherwise the reader is lost and your statement is not longer good.

Strong vs Valid Arguments

My understanding of strong and valid arguments is that the word choice of the statement or statements is what makes that statement either strong or valid.

For a statement to be strong, there has to be some way for the premise to be true while the conclusion is false, all occurring at the same time. For example: A lady came in to a store to purchase hair clippers for her dog. Two days later, the same lady brought the clippers back for a refund stating that she decided to take the dog to the groomers and had not used the product. The clippers were extremely hairy and dirty. The dog had missing patches of hair. Therefore the lady must have tried to clip her dog and it didn’t work out the way she planned.

For a statement to be valid, when there is no possibility of the premise being true while the conclusion is false. For example: At work I am able to earn an extra $30 if I sell $520 worth of promo items over the course of a week. My weeks total for the sale of promo items was $525 by Saturday. This means I am entitled to my $30 bonus.

Subjective & Objective

Subjective deals with statements that depend on a person's feelings, or rather their personal standards. A subjective claim I would have would be: my dog is the cutest lab out there. Now the fact that she is cute depends on whether or not I feel she is cute or not. The opinion is based on my feelings for my dog and how it is I choose to view her.

Objective deals with statements that do not belong under subjective. These deal with impersonal standards and are often too vague of a statement. An objective claim would then be: the bag of apples weighed two pounds. This statement does not deal with it being true or false, it simply means that the bag of apples weighed in at two pounds. There is nothing more that can be argued about this.

I think overall subjective statements are statements that we typically use in our conversations due to our nature of being often outspoken people. Luckily for us and our culture we do have objective claims which are often just to the point and don’t rely on opinions.

Tehya K

Vague and Ambiguous Statements

So my little story deals with a customer at work. Again I work at a holistic pet food store, so I have funny questions all the time that I have to try and answer. I was having a conversation with a co-worker of mine when a Bernese Mountain Dog walked in. My co-worker stated "Oh my goodness that is the biggest dog ever!" Now working in a pet store I am exposed to tons of dogs within a day and being an avid dog lover I know a lot about breeds. I looked at my co-worker and said are you sure that is the biggest dog? Her statement left a question in my mind about what it is she considers big and small. Her statement was overall ambiguous simply because her version of big and small differed from my version. By her having three small Chihuahuas that weigh less than ten pounds each, a Bernese would seem large. Yet a Great Dane is twice as tall, but may weigh around the same, where as a Mastiff is about the same height but could possibly weigh more than both the Bernese and Great Dane, separately. I thought it was funny, especially since I have always had large dogs, small to me is my sixty pound Chocolate Lab<3

Tehya K

Introductory Post

Hey Everyone,
I am a Business Management major. I have had very little experience with blogs and communication other than email, facebook, texting, that sort of "communication." I currently attend SJSU twice a week, and work the other five days. I live with my sister, brother in law and twin niece and nephew who just turned three. My life can get quite hectic, but i love it. I work at a holistic pet food store, and absolutly love it. My main interests currently involves my job and pets. I have always been an avid dog lover and with my job this has simply increased. I look forward to chatting with everyone throughout the semester.

Tehya K